Re-power Engine HP Questions

[emberleybillgmail-com]

Hello Pearson Owners,
I am in the process of getting bids on a new engine. Prices and suggestions vary widely.
Looking at Volvo, Yanmar and Beta Marine. Do any of you have suggestions on horsepower? I read Pete’s story about installing a 50 HP Beta Marine then read a post yesterday about installing an 80 HP Yanmar. Any suggestions are welcome.
Thanks!
Bill Emberley
SV Running Tab P424 86

[Paperbird]

I went with the Beta 50 for our 422.  Very satisfied. Plenty of power. At 75% WOT we have a calm water speed of 7.25 kts. I would be wary of overpowering.  

Greg Long

Author, The New Game Changers: Driving Performance by Focusing on What Matters

greg@paperbird.us

443.995.5551

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http://www.longandnewman.com

But if not…

[john stevenson]

Bill,

A lot depends on what type of sailing you are doing/plan on doing.  All of us, at one time or another, have wished we had a little extra power to goose the SOG – trying to make that next bridge opening on the AICW or beat a T'storm into an anchorage.  I think 50-60 HP is adequate for normal performance under power.  If you think you're situation might call for a little extra speed on a regular basis, then you probably need some reserve HP.  Of course that extra power will come at a price, and maybe a more complicated installation.

FWIW, I repowered with a Yanmar 4JH4AE at 54HP and it is more than adequate.

Regards,
John Stevenson
http://www.svsarah.com
Sarah's Blog

[Rob Osterman]

Hi Bill,

I repowered with the latest generation Yanmar 4JH80. I’ve been very happy with the results.

I was pricing out Yanmar’s and Beta’s at the boat show. I was looking at the Beta 75 and found it was much more expensive than the Yanmar options ($17.5k+ just for the engine.) There was a $1,500 difference between the 57HP and the 80HP Yanmar and both were still much cheaper than the 75HP Beta engine.

Rob

[emberleybillgmail-com]

Thanks for the info Rob.  Did you have to do any major modifications to your existing transmission to install the Yanmar 80 HP?  I was looking at a Volvo 75HP which is a 55 with a turbo but it was way more pricey.  Still waiting for the 3 bids to come in and will share the quotes with all who are interested.

Bill

Bill Emberley

Edit One Productions, Inc.

2310 Clement Ave.

Alameda, CA 94501

Studio 510-814-9519

Cell 415-279-1340

Fax 510 814-6945

[emberleybillgmail-com]

Thanks John,

I am letting 3 shops with three different engine types bid,  Obviously do not want to overpower or over spend.  The first quote for a Volvo 75 HP came in at 35K.  Crazy!

Will share intel as it arrives.

Best,

Bill

Bill Emberley

Edit One Productions, Inc.

2310 Clement Ave.

Alameda, CA 94501

Studio 510-814-9519

Cell 415-279-1340

Fax 510 814-6945

[Rob Osterman]

Bill,

I didn’t have to do any modifications to the transmission itself. There’s an adapter plate my marine transmission shop installed to connect the Yanmar to the Velvet Drive. The adapter, damper plate, and transmission cooler cost around $500.

Is your $35k Volvo quote for the complete installation with labor? My overall project spend including new fuel tank, engine foundation mounts, engine, and all related parts (not including Walter V-Drive rebuild) came close to $30k.

[emberleybillgmail-com]

Thanks Greg,

Looking at the Beta 50 and just got a fairly reasonable bid.

The 424 is a displacement hull.  Not sure what the hull speed is but I would think that no matter how much engine you put in her she'll only plow along so fast.

Bill Emberley

Edit One Productions, Inc.

2310 Clement Ave.

Alameda, CA 94501

Studio 510-814-9519

Cell 415-279-1340

Fax 510 814-6945

[unabated]

Very true about displacement hull… In calm water.  

Where you need a little more zip, is when motoring against a head wind or a very adverse current.  Such as the cuts between the islands in the Bahamas.  

I found out what a difference 1 inch of pitch makes in prop.  I thought going from a 13 to a 12 was great, so I went 1 more to an 11 inch pitch.   Yikes did that suck.   Had trouble motoring against 5  knot current  Went back to a 12 inch.  BTW it’s a W58. 

So…. A little reserve HP is nice. 

Depends on what kind of sailing you do. 

YMMV

Alan

Unabated 140

[JodyandStephen]

Hi Bill,

We have just bought a Beta 50, [with an apdapter to bolt on the Velvet Drive, remote oil filter, high rise exhaust and shallow oil pan].  Although Torque is indeed a more appropriate measure for boat power, many of the technical requirements reviews use horsepower.  A review of our P424’s displacement [cruise weight], water line length, beam, hull shape showed that maximum thoeretical hull speed was met with 43 horsepower.  This calcuation was conducted by Nanni, who use the same Kubota engine as Beta.  

We don’t see the need to weigh the boat down with more engine than can be used, nor do we buy the extra capacity argument.  The Beta was not the cheapest option, but the 5 year warranty helped to assuage the price differences, and the parts policy and availability wins hands down for us.  Having sailed into over thirty countries now, we have an idea how parts can be a real issue, ourselves, and from others with other ‘very popular brands’.

 

Stephen Parry

S.V. Blue Pelican

 

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[RichCarter]

My repower ran about $23K just for parts.  A full repower might cost another $12K for labor.  $35K may not be unreasonable if they do all the labor and replace everything.

 

Rich

 

[RichCarter]

I think that 7.8kts is about the best you can do.    The boat does about 7.3kts with ease.  Driving faster creates a stern wave that runs up the back of the transom.  The more throttle, the bigger the wave.  Speed increases a bit but it’s a point of diminishing returns.  Having the extra power lets you push into waves and seas that a smaller engine would have trouble with.  It lets you back off the throttle at cruising speed for a more comfortable ride.  My engine is 75HP.  The W60 I replaced was only 50HP and wouldn’t push the boat faster than about 7KTS.  I think you can get by with a 50HP engine but I suggest going for a bit larger engine if you can mate your prop and v-drive to the larger engine.  The cost of repowering is huge.  The engine is only part of the cost.  Adding another boat unit of cost the engine won’t really make that much a difference in the total cost of the project.

 

A larger engine will burn more fuel, but only if you push the throttle up.  Cruising at the same speed, I think a 50HP and a 75HP engine use about the same fuel.  I don’t think you really need 75HP however.  60 or 65 HP is probably enough.

 

Rich

 

[ewanoleary]

My electric repower is running $19k thus far and I’ve still got some battery management systems to spec.

Ewan

[kalinowski]

$19k sounds like the ballpark.  My total ran around $16k.  This includes yard fees as I had her hauled and  had to pay for the yard’s crane to lift the Westy out.  I did wind up saving around $3.5k as my son works at West and we enjoyed his BIG discount on batteries andi all the small bits & pieces.  Adding the West employee savings to my out of pocket puts me near your total.

[Richard Jank]

I have an Isuzu 58hp installed in my 424.  Check Klassen Motor Works in Portland or Seattle.  Excellent unit.

[Tor]

Bill,

 

I repowered 9 years ago with a 54HP Yanmar 4JH4AE, which cost me $16k (very) professionally installed, minus $2k I got for the old Westerbeke by advertising it on Craig’s List. I kept the original Paragon transmission, though, which probably reduced the price of the new engine, but turned out to be a mistake because it wound up costing me $2k for a total, like-new transmission rebuild immediately afterwards. So, after the soot settled, $16k to repower 9 years ago.

 

This is my 2nd new Yanmar in a cruising sailboat. For me Yanmars have been flawless, needing nothing but clean fuel, oil changes and an occasional impeller replacement. They’re so common you can find mechanics all over the world that know them. No doubt there are other excellent choices, but what I have is perfect so I haven’t gone searching. As for horsepower, I think it’s fair to say I’ve sailed, motored and motorsailed my 424 in every condition there is except a hurricane (knock on wood). The only time I ever have cause to run this engine at full power is for maintenance, i.e., to blow out any carbon build-up. I’ve never lacked for horsepower or speed. On the contrary, I tend to motorsail a fair amount, especially to windward with this boat, running the engine between 1200 and 1600 RPM. When just plain motoring in moderate conditions I run 1600 to 1800 RPM, occasionally 2000 and very rarely 2200. I do not use the engine just to charge batteries, having a Honda generator and other stuff for that. My average diesel consumption rate is 0.6 GPH.

 

Best of all, every time I turn the key, that big, beautiful Yanmar starts up instantly and doesn’t stop until I turn it off. I can ask no more of an engine than that.

 

Tor

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Silverheels, P-424 #17

http://www.silverheels.us

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