PVC plumbing and cockpit drains

[Anonymous]

Tor
I’ve had water freeze in PVC sanitation hose without failure. This is the flexible stuff we all use for various plumbing connections. This can happen if something gets stuck in the pipe like leaves or a bottle cap. The last item is pretty easy to get caught in the cockpit drain hoses. All you need is a careless guest onboard who insists on metrosexual beer and you are bound to get one in the cockpit drain. Many years ago, I put a stainless pin across each cockpit drain in order to keep my kids legos from getting stuck down there. The pin is made from a long stainless machine screw with the head cut off. You heat the thing up with a torch while holding it with pliers. Once hot enough to melt the plactic fitting, you set it across the cockpit drain fitting, then douse it with water. It takes just 10 minutes or so to protect your cockpit drains from legos and bottle-caps.

I’ve also had water freeze in the plastic pressure water hoses Pearson used on the pressure water system for the 424. In the case of a sea-chest or manifold system such as is being discussed, you’re more or less forced to use something like PVC. The issue is to keep water from freezing in there.

Rich

Post generated from Pearson424 Forum using Mail2Forum

[Anonymous]

Ha, what a neat trick! I’ll do it. Thanks!

I don’t have plans for wintering this boat up north, but I have done so with other boats in the past, and I once stored an RV for the winter in Alaska. In my experience if you take the normal precautions – cleaning, plugging, adding anti-freeze, etc – the systems survive freezing temperatures just fine, whatever the component materials.

Tor

---

Silver Heels, P-424 #17
http://www.SilverHeels.us

---

Post generated from Pearson424 Forum using Mail2Forum

[unabated]

I agree with Tor.

I’ve been wintering boats in Western NY for the last 28 years. If you do each system properly, you will have no issues.

I make a check list so I don’t forget anything. Last year I had to add “Remove bag of potatoes from VBerth Locker”. Yuck!!

alan

[Anonymous]

I did not mean to say unexpected stuff can’t happen, like something clogging up Rich’s cockpit drain pipe. Remind me to tell you some time about wintering my last boat in Greece, where a cat got in through a sheltered cockpit porthole I’d left open for ventilation and had a litter of kittens on my bunk.

And that was only the beginning of the mess!

Tor

---

Silver Heels, P-424 #17
http://www.SilverHeels.us

---

[unabated]

A few yrs ago had a Catalina 30 in the yard that had a
small leak in his winter cover. Water had leaked in
and when it froze, busted a scupper hose. In the
spring when it rained, more water had leaked into the
boat.
The travel lift operator needed to move the boat to
launch someone else. When he lifted the boat up, all
the water shifted, causing the boat to tip in the
slings. The Catalina ended bow up, sitting on the
rudder. Not a pretty site.
a

Post generated from Pearson424 Forum using Mail2Forum

[Anonymous]

I wonder, what do you all think of re-doing the potable water with copper piping like a house? Assuming of course, fixed connections to tanks were via small sections of hose?

Bob

—
Bob Fine
Fine Software LLC
Your data on the web your way. No kidding

Post generated from Pearson424 Forum using Mail2Forum

[Anonymous]

Bob
I would have mixed feelings about using PVC or copper for pressure water lines in the boat. I’ve experienced problems with the end fittings used with plastic tubing. Most of these problems have been addressed by replacing the cheap plastic fittings with copper compression fittings and nylon compression rings. I don’t believe the nylon rings are available anymore, but copper compression rings are. Too bad, since the nylon compression rings allowed you to disassemble the fitting and reuse the parts. I’ve not had very good results reusing fittings with copper compression rings.

I’ve still had issues with the hot water line from the water heater. Water in the water tank gets hotter than what you would normally find in a domestic water system. I’ve had issues with the water line breaking. I lost count of how many times I dumped a water tank into the bilge last year. I eventually replaced the hose from the water heater to the manifold with nylon reinforced tubing.

Friends of mine built a cabin in the woods in central New Hampshire a few years ago. When the plumbed the camp, they pitched the water lines and installed drains at the low points so as to make winterizing easy for them. I suppose you could do this with the pressure water system on your boat, but snaking water pipe through cabinets and bilge doesn’t lend itself to pitching the pipes as you might wish. We have a camp in NY, but our pipes weren’t put in this way. Its a pain to blow them out when winterizing. Sometimes we don’t get all the water out of one spot or anther and the pipe splits open when the water freezes. I think you would find it difficult to reliably blow the pipes out.

On the other hand, winterizing is pretty easy with the plastic tubing. All I have to do is drain the water heater, open the faucets, remove the water filter and toss a gallon of potable anti-freeze in the water tanks. If it were hard plastic or copper, I’d have to blow out the lines. This would be problematic.

Folks who keep their boats in slips might have a direct connection to a water supply. If I used this kind of connection, I’d want a fresh water system that was pretty reliable. I’d hate to come back to the boat to find that one of the water lines had broken and allowed the bilge to flood with city water. One would think that a shutoff of some kind would prevent this kind of problem, but I know I’d eventually forget to turn the water off. I think the right solution is to use a better quality plastic tubing than Pearson used. Someone must make something like this. West Marine sells something with the Whale brand on it, but it’s very expensive. If anyone has a suggested supplier for quality tubing at a reasonable price, please let us know.

—
Rich Carter

[Anonymous]

I can vouch for freezing pipes. This winter my new to me 424 was stored uncovered in Maine. I plugged (but not well enough) the deck drains. 2 of them had old and slightly cracked hoses. They are now full of frozen water and very well cracked…… something else to replace prior to launch!
Eric

[Anonymous]

Ah Rich,

I have a better way to winterize. And it doesn't involve that awful tasting anti-freeze that only gets rinsed out at the end of the season.

I install a shore water inlet. At a dock, I use a hose and hey! presto fresh water without using the tank and pump.

But when winterization comes along, baby, that's where it shines! I connect a fitting made up to match an air compressor with the hose fitting. One by one, from the farthest to the nearest I open up the faucet, cold first, hot last, and run it until no more water blows out.

The hot water heater is drained, the cold water is dry (as is the hot water), and if there are a few drops of water in the system, so what? As long as there's expansion space it's all good.

I also drain the tanks to the bilge using a siphon on a fitting before the pressure pump.

This all takes about an hour. The nice thing is that there's no polyproplyene glycol in the system (ever had a colonoscopy? The stuff they make you drink a gallon of? That pink stuff without the pink. You still want it in your water system?)

Bob

On Tue, Mar 11, 2008 at 3:54 PM, < ([email][/email])> wrote:

Bob
I would have mixed feelings about using PVC or copper for pressure water lines in the boat. I've experienced problems with the end fittings used with plastic tubing. Most of these problems have been addressed by replacing the cheap plastic fittings with copper compression fittings and nylon compression rings. I don't believe the nylon rings are available anymore, but copper compression rings are. Too bad, since the nylon compression rings allowed you to disassemble the fitting and reuse the parts. I've not had very good results reusing fittings with copper compression rings.

I've still had issues with the hot water line from the water heater. Water in the water tank gets hotter than what you would normally find in a domestic water system. I've had issues with the water line breaking. I lost count of how many times I dumped a water tank into the bilge last year. I eventually replaced the hose from the water heater to the manifold with nylon reinforced tubing.

Friends of mine built a cabin in the woods in central New Hampshire a few years ago. When the plumbed the camp, they pitched the water lines and installed drains at the low points so as to make winterizing easy for them. I suppose you could do this with the pressure water system on your boat, but snaking water pipe through cabinets and bilge doesn't lend itself to pitching the pipes as you might wish. We have a camp in NY, but our pipes weren't put in this way. Its a pain to blow them out when winterizing. Sometimes we don't get all the water out of one spot or anther and the pipe splits open when the water freezes. I think you would find it difficult to reliably blow the pipes out.

On the other hand, winterizing is pretty easy with the plastic tubing. All I have to do is drain the water heater, open the faucets, remove the water filter and toss a gallon of potable anti-freeze in the water tanks. If it were hard plastic or copper, I'd have to blow out the lines. This would be problematic.

Folks who keep their boats in slips might have a direct connection to a water supply. If I used this kind of connection, I'd want a fresh water system that was pretty reliable. I'd hate to come back to the boat to find that one of the water lines had broken and allowed the bilge to flood with city water. One would think that a shutoff of some kind would prevent this kind of problem, but I know I'd eventually forget to turn the water off. I think the right solution is to use a better quality plastic tubing than Pearson used. Someone must make something like this. West Marine sells something with the Whale brand on it, but it's very expensive. If anyone has a suggested supplier for quality tubing at a reasonable price, please let us know.

—
Rich Carter
—
Rich Carter

---

Original message

---

From: “Robert Fine” < ([email][/email])>

I wonder, what do you all think of re-doing the potable water with copper
piping like a house? Assuming of course, fixed connections to tanks were
via small sections of hose?

Bob

On Tue, Mar 11, 2008 at 9:48 AM, alan P < ([email][/email])> wrote:

A few yrs ago had a Catalina 30 in the yard that had a
small leak in his winter cover. Water had leaked in
and when it froze, busted a scupper hose. In the
spring when it rained, more water had leaked into the
boat.
The travel lift operator needed to move the boat to
launch someone else. When he lifted the boat up, all
the water shifted, causing the boat to tip in the
slings. The Catalina ended bow up, sitting on the
rudder. Not a pretty site.
a
— Silver Heels < ([email][/email])> wrote:

I did not mean to say unexpected stuff can't happen,
like something clogging up Rich's cockpit drain
pipe. Remind me to
tell you some time about wintering my last boat in
Greece, where a cat got in through a sheltered
cockpit porthole I'd
left open for ventilation and had a litter of
kittens on my bunk. And that was only the beginning
of the mess!

Tor

---

Silver Heels, P-424 #17
http://www.SilverHeels.us

---

---

Original Message

---

From: alan P [mailto: ()]
Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2008 7:03 AM
To: Mailing List (Mailing List)
Subject: RE: PVC plumbing and cockpit

drains

I agree with Tor.
I've been wintering boats in Western NY for the

last

28 years. If you do each system properly, you will
have no issues.
I make a check list so I don't forget anything.
Last year I had to add “Remove bag of potatoes

from

VBerth Locker”. Yuck!!
alan

— Silver Heels < ([email][/email])> wrote:

Ha, what a neat trick! I'll do it. Thanks!

I don't have plans for wintering this boat up

north,

but I have done so with
other boats in the past, and I once stored an RV

for

the winter in Alaska.
In my experience if you take the normal

precautions

– cleaning, plugging,
adding anti-freeze, etc – the systems survive
freezing temperatures just
fine, whatever the component materials.
Tor

---

Silver Heels, P-424 #17
http://www.SilverHeels.us

---

---

Original Message

---

From: Rich Carter

[mailto: ()]

Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2008 3:56 PM
To: Mailing List (Mailing List)
Cc: ()
Subject: RE: PVC plumbing and

cockpit

drains

Tor
I've had water freeze in PVC sanitation hose
without failure. This is the
flexible stuff we all use for various plumbing
connections. This can happen
if something gets stuck in the pipe like leaves

or a

bottle cap. The last
item is pretty easy to get caught in the cockpit
drain hoses. All you need
is a careless guest onboard who insists on
metrosexual beer and you are
bound to get one in the cockpit drain. Many

years

ago, I put a stainless
pin across each cockpit drain in order to keep

my

kids legos from getting
stuck down there. The pin is made from a long
stainless machine screw with
the head cut off. You heat the thing up with a
torch while holding it with
pliers. Once hot enough to melt the plactic
fitting, you set it across the
cockpit drain fitting, then douse it with water.

It

takes just 10 minutes
or so to protect your cockpit drains from legos

and

bottle-caps.

I've also had water freeze in the plastic

pressure

water hoses Pearson
used on the pressure water system for the 424.

In

the case of a sea-chest
or manifold system such as is being discussed,
you're more or less forced to
use something like PVC. The issue is to keep

water

from freezing in there.

Rich

---

From: Silver Heels

[mailto: ()]

Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2008 2:25 PM
To: Mailing List (Mailing List)
Subject: RE: PVC plumbing

Thanks for sharing that story, Rich. I

wonder,

though, if any pipe
material would stand up to being filled with

water

and then frozen. Seems
like that'd burst whatever confined pipe, hose

or

tube it's in, whether PVC
or something else. Or would it? Is there some

kind

of marine plumbing that
could withstand that pressure?
Tor

---

Silver Heels, P-424 #17
http://www.SilverHeels.us

---

---

Original Message

---

From: Rich Carter
[mailto: ()]
Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2008 2:14 PM
To: Mailing List (Mailing List)
Subject: RE: PVC plumbing

Tor
No seacocks involved. This all happened

about

30 years ago. The boat
was a Grampian 30. It is similar to a Pearson

30,

but not quite as well
built. The cockpit had four drains, one in each
corner. The drains ran out
the back of the trasom to a pair of

through-hulls

just above the waterline.
I took the boat out for a sail one day late in

the

fall and observed that
the automatic bilge pump was on. I returned to

the

mooring and investigated.
The PVC pipe that I used to connect the deck

drains

had shattered. When the
boat heeled over on either tack, one of the
through-hulls was under water.
This allowed water to back-down the drain pipe.
Since the PVC was in
pieces, it drained directly into the bilge. The

way

this particlar boat was
designed, water would sometimes back down the

drain

pipe into the cockpit.
This would get your feet wet.

I surmised that the PVC pipes had

collected

water which froze in the
pipe. This can happen if you get a cold spell
followed by rain and sleet.
Once the pipe was obstructed, it subsequently

filled

=== message truncated ===

________________________________________________________________________________
____

Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page.
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

---

To unsubscribe, e-mail: ()
For additional commands, e-mail: ()

—
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Fine Software LLC
Your data on the web your way. No kidding

---

Forwarded message

---

From: “Robert Fine” < ([email][/email])>
To: Mailing List (Mailing List)
Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 15:06:22 +0000
Subject: Re: PVC plumbing and cockpit drains
I wonder, what do you all think of re-doing the potable water with copper piping like a house? Assuming of course, fixed connections to tanks were via small sections of hose?

Bob

On Tue, Mar 11, 2008 at 9:48 AM, alan P < ([email][/email])> wrote:

A few yrs ago had a Catalina 30 in the yard that had a
small leak in his winter cover. Water had leaked in
and when it froze, busted a scupper hose. In the
spring when it rained, more water had leaked into the
boat.
The travel lift operator needed to move the boat to
launch someone else. When he lifted the boat up, all
the water shifted, causing the boat to tip in the
slings. The Catalina ended bow up, sitting on the
rudder. Not a pretty site.

a
— Silver Heels < ([email][/email])> wrote:

I did not mean to say unexpected stuff can't happen,
like something clogging up Rich's cockpit drain
pipe. Remind me to
tell you some time about wintering my last boat in
Greece, where a cat got in through a sheltered
cockpit porthole I'd
left open for ventilation and had a litter of
kittens on my bunk. And that was only the beginning
of the mess!

Tor

---

Silver Heels, P-424 #17
http://www.SilverHeels.us

---

---

Original Message

---

From: alan P [mailto: ()]
Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2008 7:03 AM
To: Mailing List (Mailing List)
Subject: RE: PVC plumbing and cockpit

drains

I agree with Tor.
I've been wintering boats in Western NY for the

last

28 years. If you do each system properly, you will
have no issues.
I make a check list so I don't forget anything.
Last year I had to add “Remove bag of potatoes

from

VBerth Locker”. Yuck!!
alan

— Silver Heels < ([email][/email])> wrote:

Ha, what a neat trick! I'll do it. Thanks!

I don't have plans for wintering this boat up

north,

but I have done so with
other boats in the past, and I once stored an RV

for

the winter in Alaska.
In my experience if you take the normal

precautions

– cleaning, plugging,
adding anti-freeze, etc – the systems survive
freezing temperatures just
fine, whatever the component materials.
Tor

---

Silver Heels, P-424 #17
http://www.SilverHeels.us

---

---

Original Message

---

From: Rich Carter

[mailto: ()]

Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2008 3:56 PM
To: Mailing List (Mailing List)
Cc: ()
Subject: RE: PVC plumbing and

cockpit

drains

Tor
I've had water freeze in PVC sanitation hose
without failure. This is the
flexible stuff we all use for various plumbing
connections. This can happen
if something gets stuck in the pipe like leaves

or a

bottle cap. The last
item is pretty easy to get caught in the cockpit
drain hoses. All you need
is a careless guest onboard who insists on
metrosexual beer and you are
bound to get one in the cockpit drain. Many

years

ago, I put a stainless
pin across each cockpit drain in order to keep

my

kids legos from getting
stuck down there. The pin is made from a long
stainless machine screw with
the head cut off. You heat the thing up with a
torch while holding it with
pliers. Once hot enough to melt the plactic
fitting, you set it across the
cockpit drain fitting, then douse it with water.

It

takes just 10 minutes
or so to protect your cockpit drains from legos

and

bottle-caps.

I've also had water freeze in the plastic

pressure

water hoses Pearson
used on the pressure water system for the 424.

In

the case of a sea-chest
or manifold system such as is being discussed,
you're more or less forced to
use something like PVC. The issue is to keep

water

from freezing in there.

Rich

---

From: Silver Heels

[mailto: ()]

Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2008 2:25 PM
To: Mailing List (Mailing List)
Subject: RE: PVC plumbing

Thanks for sharing that story, Rich. I

wonder,

though, if any pipe
material would stand up to being filled with

water

and then frozen. Seems
like that'd burst whatever confined pipe, hose

or

tube it's in, whether PVC
or something else. Or would it? Is there some

kind

of marine plumbing that
could withstand that pressure?
Tor

---

Silver Heels, P-424 #17
http://www.SilverHeels.us

---

---

Original Message

---

From: Rich Carter
[mailto: ()]
Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2008 2:14 PM
To: Mailing List (Mailing List)
Subject: RE: PVC plumbing

Tor
No seacocks involved. This all happened

about

30 years ago. The boat
was a Grampian 30. It is similar to a Pearson

30,

but not quite as well
built. The cockpit had four drains, one in each
corner. The drains ran out
the back of the trasom to a pair of

through-hulls

just above the waterline.
I took the boat out for a sail one day late in

the

fall and observed that
the automatic bilge pump was on. I returned to

the

mooring and investigated.
The PVC pipe that I used to connect the deck

drains

had shattered. When the
boat heeled over on either tack, one of the
through-hulls was under water.
This allowed water to back-down the drain pipe.
Since the PVC was in
pieces, it drained directly into the bilge. The

way

this particlar boat was
designed, water would sometimes back down the

drain

pipe into the cockpit.
This would get your feet wet.

I surmised that the PVC pipes had

collected

water which froze in the
pipe. This can happen if you get a cold spell
followed by rain and sleet.
Once the pipe was obstructed, it subsequently

filled

=== message truncated ===

____________________________________________________________________________________
Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page.
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

---

To unsubscribe, e-mail: ()
For additional commands, e-mail: ()

—
Bob Fine
Fine Software LLC
Your data on the web your way. No kidding

---

To unsubscribe, e-mail: ()
For additional commands, e-mail: ()

—
Bob Fine
Fine Software LLC
Your data on the web your way. No kidding

Post generated from Pearson424 Forum using Mail2Forum

[unabated]

I drain the hot water tank, after relieving any
pressure in the system. I disconnect the in and out
hoses to the tank and install a setup I made with
unions to the reconnect the pressure system without
the hot water heater connected. Which BTW is a great
to have in case your heater craps out while your away
from the dock, you can always install this thing and
be able to use the preussre system.

I then drain each of the tanks till almost dry, I then
remove the hose at the source side of the galley pump
and attach a dry vac to it,sucking out any remaining
fluid.
This way the system is dry, no pink fluid is left and
if there is any liquid left, it wont freeze.
Although I hear some people use vodka cause it’s
cheaper than the pink stuff.

— Robert Fine <> wrote:

Ah Rich,

I have a better way to winterize. And it doesn’t
involve that awful tasting
anti-freeze that only gets rinsed out at the end of
the season.

I install a shore water inlet. At a dock, I use a
hose and hey! presto
fresh water without using the tank and pump.

But when winterization comes along, baby, that’s
where it shines! I connect
a fitting made up to match an air compressor with
the hose fitting. One by
one, from the farthest to the nearest I open up the
faucet, cold first, hot
last, and run it until no more water blows out.

The hot water heater is drained, the cold water is
dry (as is the hot
water), and if there are a few drops of water in the
system, so what? As
long as there’s expansion space it’s all good.

I also drain the tanks to the bilge using a siphon
on a fitting before the
pressure pump.

This all takes about an hour. The nice thing is
that there’s no
polyproplyene glycol in the system (ever had a
colonoscopy? The stuff they
make you drink a gallon of? That pink stuff without
the pink. You still
want it in your water system?)

Bob

On Tue, Mar 11, 2008 at 3:54 PM,
<> wrote:

Bob
I would have mixed feelings about using PVC or

copper for pressure water

lines in the boat. I’ve experienced problems with

the end fittings used

with plastic tubing. Most of these problems have

been addressed by

replacing the cheap plastic fittings with copper

compression fittings and

nylon compression rings. I don’t believe the

nylon rings are available

anymore, but copper compression rings are. Too

bad, since the nylon

compression rings allowed you to disassemble the

fitting and reuse the

parts. I’ve not had very good results reusing

fittings with copper

compression rings.

I’ve still had issues with the hot water line from

the water heater.

Water in the water tank gets hotter than what you

would normally find in a

domestic water system. I’ve had issues with the

water line breaking. I

lost count of how many times I dumped a water tank

into the bilge last year.

I eventually replaced the hose from the water

heater to the manifold with

nylon reinforced tubing.

Friends of mine built a cabin in the woods in

central New Hampshire a few

years ago. When the plumbed the camp, they

pitched the water lines and

installed drains at the low points so as to make

winterizing easy for them.

I suppose you could do this with the pressure

water system on your boat,

but snaking water pipe through cabinets and bilge

doesn’t lend itself to

pitching the pipes as you might wish. We have a

camp in NY, but our pipes

weren’t put in this way. Its a pain to blow them

out when winterizing.

Sometimes we don’t get all the water out of one

spot or anther and the pipe

splits open when the water freezes. I think you

would find it difficult to

reliably blow the pipes out.

On the other hand, winterizing is pretty easy with

the plastic tubing.

All I have to do is drain the water heater, open

the faucets, remove the

water filter and toss a gallon of potable

anti-freeze in the water tanks.

If it were hard plastic or copper, I’d have to

blow out the lines. This

would be problematic.

Folks who keep their boats in slips might have a

direct connection to a

water supply. If I used this kind of connection,

I’d want a fresh water

system that was pretty reliable. I’d hate to come

back to the boat to find

that one of the water lines had broken and allowed

the bilge to flood with

city water. One would think that a shutoff of

some kind would prevent this

kind of problem, but I know I’d eventually forget

to turn the water off. I

think the right solution is to use a better

quality plastic tubing than

Pearson used. Someone must make something like

this. West Marine sells

something with the Whale brand on it, but it’s

very expensive. If anyone

has a suggested supplier for quality tubing at a

reasonable price, please

let us know.

—
Rich Carter
—
Rich Carter

---

Original message

---

From: “Robert Fine” <>

I wonder, what do you all think of re-doing the

potable water with

copper

piping like a house? Assuming of course, fixed

connections to tanks

were

via small sections of hose?

Bob

On Tue, Mar 11, 2008 at 9:48 AM, alan P

<> wrote:

A few yrs ago had a Catalina 30 in the yard

that had a

small leak in his winter cover. Water had

leaked in

and when it froze, busted a scupper hose. In

the

spring when it rained, more water had leaked

into the

boat.
The travel lift operator needed to move the

boat to

launch someone else. When he lifted the boat

up, all

the water shifted, causing the boat to tip in

the

slings. The Catalina ended bow up, sitting on

the

rudder. Not a pretty site.
a
— Silver Heels <> wrote:

I did not mean to say unexpected stuff can’t

happen,

like something clogging up Rich’s cockpit

drain

pipe. Remind me to
tell you some time about wintering my last

boat in

Greece, where a cat got in through a

sheltered

cockpit porthole I’d
left open for ventilation and had a litter

of

kittens on my bunk. And that was only the

beginning

of the mess!

Tor

---

Silver Heels, P-424 #17
http://www.SilverHeels.us

---

---

Original Message

---

From: alan P [mailto:]
Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2008 7:03 AM
To: Mailing List
Subject: RE: PVC plumbing and

cockpit

=== message truncated ===

____________________________________________________________________________________
Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page.
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Post generated from Pearson424 Forum using Mail2Forum

[Anonymous]

And in the spring, a little vodka from the tap and some orange juice….

On Wed, Mar 12, 2008 at 7:58 AM, alan P < ([email][/email])> wrote:

I drain the hot water tank, after relieving any
pressure in the system. I disconnect the in and out
hoses to the tank and install a setup I made with
unions to the reconnect the pressure system without
the hot water heater connected. Which BTW is a great
to have in case your heater craps out while your away
from the dock, you can always install this thing and
be able to use the preussre system.

I then drain each of the tanks till almost dry, I then
remove the hose at the source side of the galley pump
and attach a dry vac to it,sucking out any remaining
fluid.
This way the system is dry, no pink fluid is left and
if there is any liquid left, it wont freeze.
Although I hear some people use vodka cause it's
cheaper than the pink stuff.

— Robert Fine < ([email][/email])> wrote:

Ah Rich,

I have a better way to winterize. And it doesn't
involve that awful tasting
anti-freeze that only gets rinsed out at the end of
the season.

I install a shore water inlet. At a dock, I use a
hose and hey! presto
fresh water without using the tank and pump.

But when winterization comes along, baby, that's
where it shines! I connect
a fitting made up to match an air compressor with
the hose fitting. One by
one, from the farthest to the nearest I open up the
faucet, cold first, hot
last, and run it until no more water blows out.

The hot water heater is drained, the cold water is
dry (as is the hot
water), and if there are a few drops of water in the
system, so what? As
long as there's expansion space it's all good.

I also drain the tanks to the bilge using a siphon
on a fitting before the
pressure pump.

This all takes about an hour. The nice thing is
that there's no
polyproplyene glycol in the system (ever had a
colonoscopy? The stuff they
make you drink a gallon of? That pink stuff without
the pink. You still
want it in your water system?)

Bob

On Tue, Mar 11, 2008 at 3:54 PM,
< ([email][/email])> wrote:

Bob
I would have mixed feelings about using PVC or

copper for pressure water

lines in the boat. I've experienced problems with

the end fittings used

with plastic tubing. Most of these problems have

been addressed by

replacing the cheap plastic fittings with copper

compression fittings and

nylon compression rings. I don't believe the

nylon rings are available

anymore, but copper compression rings are. Too

bad, since the nylon

compression rings allowed you to disassemble the

fitting and reuse the

parts. I've not had very good results reusing

fittings with copper

compression rings.

I've still had issues with the hot water line from

the water heater.

Water in the water tank gets hotter than what you

would normally find in a

domestic water system. I've had issues with the

water line breaking. I

lost count of how many times I dumped a water tank

into the bilge last year.

I eventually replaced the hose from the water

heater to the manifold with

nylon reinforced tubing.

Friends of mine built a cabin in the woods in

central New Hampshire a few

years ago. When the plumbed the camp, they

pitched the water lines and

installed drains at the low points so as to make

winterizing easy for them.

I suppose you could do this with the pressure

water system on your boat,

but snaking water pipe through cabinets and bilge

doesn't lend itself to

pitching the pipes as you might wish. We have a

camp in NY, but our pipes

weren't put in this way. Its a pain to blow them

out when winterizing.

Sometimes we don't get all the water out of one

spot or anther and the pipe

splits open when the water freezes. I think you

would find it difficult to

reliably blow the pipes out.

On the other hand, winterizing is pretty easy with

the plastic tubing.

All I have to do is drain the water heater, open

the faucets, remove the

water filter and toss a gallon of potable

anti-freeze in the water tanks.

If it were hard plastic or copper, I'd have to

blow out the lines. This

would be problematic.

Folks who keep their boats in slips might have a

direct connection to a

water supply. If I used this kind of connection,

I'd want a fresh water

system that was pretty reliable. I'd hate to come

back to the boat to find

that one of the water lines had broken and allowed

the bilge to flood with

city water. One would think that a shutoff of

some kind would prevent this

kind of problem, but I know I'd eventually forget

to turn the water off. I

think the right solution is to use a better

quality plastic tubing than

Pearson used. Someone must make something like

this. West Marine sells

something with the Whale brand on it, but it's

very expensive. If anyone

has a suggested supplier for quality tubing at a

reasonable price, please

let us know.

—
Rich Carter
—
Rich Carter

---

Original message

---

From: “Robert Fine” < ([email][/email])>

I wonder, what do you all think of re-doing the

potable water with

copper

piping like a house? Assuming of course, fixed

connections to tanks

were

via small sections of hose?

Bob

On Tue, Mar 11, 2008 at 9:48 AM, alan P

< ([email][/email])> wrote:

A few yrs ago had a Catalina 30 in the yard

that had a

small leak in his winter cover. Water had

leaked in

and when it froze, busted a scupper hose. In

the

spring when it rained, more water had leaked

into the

boat.
The travel lift operator needed to move the

boat to

launch someone else. When he lifted the boat

up, all

the water shifted, causing the boat to tip in

the

slings. The Catalina ended bow up, sitting on

the

rudder. Not a pretty site.
a
— Silver Heels < ([email][/email])> wrote:

I did not mean to say unexpected stuff can't

happen,

like something clogging up Rich's cockpit

drain

pipe. Remind me to
tell you some time about wintering my last

boat in

Greece, where a cat got in through a

sheltered

cockpit porthole I'd
left open for ventilation and had a litter

of

kittens on my bunk. And that was only the

beginning

of the mess!

Tor

---

Silver Heels, P-424 #17
http://www.SilverHeels.us

---

---

Original Message

---

From: alan P [mailto: ()]
Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2008 7:03 AM
To: Mailing List (Mailing List)
Subject: RE: PVC plumbing and

cockpit

=== message truncated ===

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Bob Fine
Fine Software LLC
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