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Is there a standard mast height for the 424? I recently took a bump at 51.08 feet. My booklet says 48′ 9″ from the DWL.
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I was having major trouble getting this posted so I kept it short on the fourth try. I have an in mast furling system. I never thought that the original booklet would have incorrect information but now I realize the furling main might not be standard and could be higher. Anybody have any real numbers? I was hoping to summer in the fresh waters of the Tennessee River which has a few bridges at 52′.
Ken.
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There are two heights for the 424, the standard ketch and the tall-ketch, sloop and cutter. My mast (sloop) is about 48′ off the deck and 53′ off the water. Add to that masthead light and antenna so I figure I need about 57′ minimum. I think the standard ketch is about 4′ shorter.
Rich
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If the Army Corp of Engineers are accurate with their numbers my masthead (no instruments etc) is just above or right at 51′. My wind transducer sticks straight out from the masthead, maybe an inch above and that’s what we hit right at the bottom of the bridge.
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Rich,
I found some other numbers in my sail plan drawings that coincide with the original booklet numbers of 48′ 9″. Someone of the past PO’s drew a mast with dimensions from the top of the grease cap (roller furling only) on the masthead to the mast step….50′ 10″ and a height of 7′ 5″ from the step to the cabintop. That might have been drawn by using the numbers in the book, I don’t know. By my rough calculations my mast step is about 2′ 4″ below the water line. Close enough to make me believe that 48′ 9″. But until I get up there and do my own measuring as is, in the water, I believe the Army Corp of Engineers have a pretty good grasp of the numbers controlling the Okeechobee.
I must be in the short rig group for sure because we went under bridges that showed 55ish’ by reading the scales at the bridge. We never touched the VHF antenna but damn it looked close as it always does.Ken
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My ketch is exactly 48.5 feet above the water because I measured it and
because I fit under the Malaca lift bridge at 49.1 feet with the antenna
down.Bob
Pardon the brevity. I’m typing this on my phone and I hate typing on my
phone.
On May 21, 2014 6:04 PM, “Page Two” wrote:Rich,
I found some other numbers in my sail plan drawings that coincide with the
original booklet numbers of 48′ 9″. Someone of the past PO’s drew a mast
with dimensions from the top of the grease cap (roller furling only) on the
masthead to the mast step….50′ 10″ and a height of 7′ 5″ from the step to
the cabintop. That might have been drawn by using the numbers in the book,
I don’t know. By my rough calculations my mast step is about 2′ 4″ below
the water line. Close enough to make me believe that 48′ 9″. But until I
get up there and do my own measuring as is, in the water, I believe the
Army Corp of Engineers have a pretty good grasp of the numbers controlling
the Okeechobee.
I must be in the short rig group for sure because we went under bridges
that showed 55ish’ by reading the scales at the bridge. We never touched
the VHF antenna but damn it looked close as it always does.Ken
Ken and Vicky # 91……Writing a New Chapter Page by Page in an Old Book._______________________________________________
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Are these waters tidal? How does the ac of e list the bridge
clearance? mean high water? those of us in the great lakes would be
clueless about this… we have seiches but no tides – ..according to docs
[listed:
https://www.pearson424.org/tiki/tiki-index.php?page=Rigging%20Information%5D
Ketch:
Mast height above WL: 48′ 10″ (14.88m)Cutter:
Mast height above WL: 51′ 8″for some reason I don’t have those measurements from a Sloop rigged boat
I believe, however, all bets would be off if you have in mast furling
because chances are your rig is non-standard– pat
Page Two wrote, On 5/21/14, 3:22 PM:
If the Army Corp of Engineers are accurate with their numbers my masthead (no instruments etc) is just above or right at 51′. My wind transducer sticks straight out from the masthead, maybe an inch above and that’s what we hit right at the bottom of the bridge.
Ken and Vicky # 91……Writing a New Chapter Page by Page in an Old Book._______________________________________________
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Depth is measured by the mean low of low. Bridge clearance is the mean high
of highs, normally averages of spring and neap tided.Pardon the brevity. I’m typing this on my phone and I hate typing on my
phone.
On May 21, 2014 7:48 PM, “pat noordsij” wrote:Are these waters tidal? How does the ac of e list the bridge clearance?
mean high water? those of us in the great lakes would be clueless about
this… we have seiches but no tides – ..according to docs
[listed: https://www.pearson424.org/tiki/tiki-index.php?page=
Rigging%20Information]
Ketch:
Mast height above WL: 48′ 10″ (14.88m)Cutter:
Mast height above WL: 51′ 8″for some reason I don’t have those measurements from a Sloop rigged boat
I believe, however, all bets would be off if you have in mast furling
because chances are your rig is non-standard– pat
Page Two wrote, On 5/21/14, 3:22 PM:
If the Army Corp of Engineers are accurate with their numbers my masthead
(no instruments etc) is just above or right at 51′. My wind transducer
sticks straight out from the masthead, maybe an inch above and that’s what
we hit right at the bottom of the bridge.
Ken and Vicky # 91……Writing a New Chapter Page by Page in an Old Book._______________________________________________
maillist mailing listhttps://pearson424.org/mailman/listinfo/maillist_pearson424.org
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Bob, do you have the roller furling?
I got some local knowledge here that its possible with a north wind blowing for awhile, which it had been for days, the bridge height could be affected. It had come around fairly strong from the east for a full two days as I was traveling though. Seems to me that would put the water down at the bridge.
I’m going up to measure, although a tad nervous not knowing the condition of the masthead. Two halyards I guess. I’m considering steps, anyone have them?Ken
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Mast ladder steps are a definite plus for a host of
reasons. If Silverheels hadn’t come with them I
would’ve added them as I did on my previous cruising
boat.One advantage of being able to scoot up to the masthead
is this technique for judging bridge clearance: Get
eye level with the top of the mast and the bottom of
the bridge as you’re approaching (but still at a safe
distance for stopping). If the view of the other side
gets bigger, you’ll fit under the bridge. If it gets
smaller, you’ll hit the bridge.Tor
Silverheels, P-424 #17
http://www.silverheels.us
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I also have steps on the main mast and would put them on the mizzen if I
ever get a wind charger.
I’ve gone up the mast several times to retrieve lost halyards, but not for
bridge clearance checks.
A lot easier (and safer IMO) than a bosun’s chair.Regards,
John Stevenson
http://www.svsarah.com
Sarah’s BlogOn Thu, May 22, 2014 at 6:00 AM, Silverheels wrote:
Quote:Mast ladder steps are a definite plus for a host of
reasons. If Silverheels hadn’t come with them I
would’ve added them as I did on my previous cruising
boat.One advantage of being able to scoot up to the masthead
is this technique for judging bridge clearance: Get
eye level with the top of the mast and the bottom of
the bridge as you’re approaching (but still at a safe
distance for stopping). If the view of the other side
gets bigger, you’ll fit under the bridge. If it gets
smaller, you’ll hit the bridge.Tor
Silverheels, P-424 #17
http://www.silverheels.us
Quote:
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Testing here. I’m posting this from email not the forum…..
I used to be able to pull myself up while Vicky tended the winch, she never
had to grind. I’m not so sure I can still do that but I’ll give it a try
today. The idea of the steps is to still use the chair but keep it easy for
her to tend. I could ask a neighbor for a hand and I will if I have to, but
I’m one of those guys that just hates asking for help. Not here of course,
this is a great way to get advise and ideas without putting people out too
much.Ken
On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 9:14 AM, John Stevenson wrote:
Quote:I also have steps on the main mast and would put them on the mizzen if I
ever get a wind charger.
I’ve gone up the mast several times to retrieve lost halyards, but not for
bridge clearance checks.
A lot easier (and safer IMO) than a bosun’s chair.Regards,
John Stevenson
http://www.svsarah.com
Sarah’s BlogOn Thu, May 22, 2014 at 6:00 AM, Silverheels
wrote:Quote:Mast ladder steps are a definite plus for a host of
reasons. If Silverheels hadn’t come with them I
would’ve added them as I did on my previous cruising
boat.One advantage of being able to scoot up to the masthead
is this technique for judging bridge clearance: Get
eye level with the top of the mast and the bottom of
the bridge as you’re approaching (but still at a safe
distance for stopping). If the view of the other side
gets bigger, you’ll fit under the bridge. If it gets
smaller, you’ll hit the bridge.Tor
Silverheels, P-424 #17
http://www.silverheels.us
Quote:
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Still testing…..
I used to be able to pull myself up while Vicky tended the winch, she never had to grind. I’m not so sure I can still do that but I’ll give it a try today. The idea of the steps is to still use the chair but keep it easy for her to tend. I could ask a neighbor for a hand and I will if I have to, but I’m one of those guys that just hates asking for help. Not here of course, this is a great way to get advise and ideas without putting people out too much.Ken
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Singlehander here too. Been up the mast using steps a lot. In calm waters using autopilot. A blast. Esp to take pictures.
AlanSent from my iPhone
On May 22, 2014, at 10:32 AM, “cstewart” wrote:
Tor. Since I think of you as a singlehander, I am wondering how you do that mast/ bridge thing.
"People cannot discover new lands until they have the courage to lose sight of the shore."
Andre Gide 1869-1951_______________________________________________
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I use a brilliant product called Mast Mate which is a nylon web ladder that
goes up with slides in the track. Sadly, the mizzen track takes 3/4″
slides and the main 7/8″ so I have two. I also use them all the time on
customer’s boats. It’s the only product that will allow you to stand over
the top of the mast.Bob
Pardon the brevity. I’m typing this on my phone and I hate typing on my
phone.
On May 22, 2014 1:13 PM, “Alan” wrote:Singlehander here too. Been up the mast using steps a lot. In calm waters
using autopilot. A blast. Esp to take pictures.
AlanSent from my iPhone
On May 22, 2014, at 10:32 AM, “cstewart”
wrote:
Tor. Since I think of you as a singlehander, I am wondering how you do
that mast/ bridge thing.
“People cannot discover new lands until they have the courage to losesight of the shore.”
Andre Gide 1869-1951
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@unabated wrote:
Singlehander here too. Been up the mast using steps a lot. In calm waters using autopilot. A blast. Esp to take pictures.
AlanSent from my iPhone
On May 22, 2014, at 10:32 AM, “cstewart” wrote:
Tor. Since I think of you as a singlehander, I am wondering how you do that mast/ bridge thing.
"People cannot discover new lands until they have the courage to lose sight of the shore."
Andre Gide 1869-1951This sounds pretty cool Alan…..no doubt!
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Got myself up there…only three rest stops. Vicky was nervous for me, I was nervous for her being nervous for me!
The damage minimal, transducer needs a new 5 point pin, cuppy things (that’s what we call them) and a direction plastic thingy too. Maybe $50 total.
Mast head height…51′ from the water.
add 5″ for anchor light
add 16″ for wind vane and wind transducer (damaged part)
add 24″ for lightning dissipate thingy
add 32″ for VHF antenna
subtract 6″ to 8″ for VHF antenna bendability and I can safely call it….53′ MAX
So no doubt I have the cutter rig. I marked all paperwork aboard accordingly.
I will get steps….for sure.
There are two 424’s here in Stuart, FL, anyone else nearby for a possible rendezvous?
Ken
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I love Stuart! You have to go to American Barbeque (I think) on the north
side of the river. I forget, but there’s a day in the week where you can
get all you can eat for like $18.Bob
On Thu, May 22, 2014 at 6:37 PM, Page Two wrote:
Got myself up there…only three rest stops. Vicky was nervous for me, I
was nervous for her being nervous for me!The damage minimal, transducer needs a new 5 point pin, cuppy things
(that’s what we call them) and a direction plastic thingy too. Maybe $50
total.Mast head height…51′ from the water.
add 5″ for anchor light
add 16″ for wind vane and wind transducer (damaged part)
add 24″ for lightning dissipate thingy
add 32″ for VHF antenna
subtract 6″ to 8″ for VHF antenna bendability and I can safely call it….53′ MAX
So no doubt I have the cutter rig. I marked all paperwork aboard
accordingly.I will get steps….for sure.
There are two 424’s here in Stuart, FL, anyone else nearby for a possible
rendezvous?Ken
Ken and Vicky # 91……Writing a New Chapter Page by Page in an Old Book._______________________________________________
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—
Bob Fine
s/v Pelican
Pearson 424 Hull #8
http://thesailinglife.blogspot.com
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Bob, I’ve looked at the Mast Mate but am disappointed that you need a track, all I have is a slot. I beieve I’m going with Sea Dog folding aluminum steps…
http://www.go2marine.com/product/209836F/sea-dog-line-folding-mast-step-aluminum.html
…and bummed I can’t find any at the price they used to be. Has any one used them and did you use threaded SS screws or pop rivets? I don’t think I will go pop rivets figuring they could weaken after lots of use. The only issue I see with screws is they need to be exactly the right length and carefully filed smooth as to not interfere with internal halyards.Ken
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I have these steps and I used 1/4-20 screws and tapped the holes in the
mast.Pete
On 5/24/2014 3:11 PM, Page Two wrote:
Bob, I’ve looked at the Mast Mate but am disappointed that you need a track, all I have is a slot. I beieve I’m going with Sea Dog folding aluminum steps…
http://www.go2marine.com/product/209836F/sea-dog-line-folding-mast-step-aluminum.html
…and bummed I can’t find any at the price they used to be. Has any one used them and did you use threaded SS screws or pop rivets? I don’t think I will go pop rivets figuring they could weaken after lots of use. The only issue I see with screws is they need to be exactly the right length and carefully filed smooth as to not interfere with internal halyards.Ken
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Hey, before you go to seadog, go to marinepartsdepot.com and see if they
still have folding steps. I have two for the mizzen.Bob
Pardon the brevity. I’m typing this on my phone and I hate typing on my
phone.
On May 24, 2014 3:12 PM, “Page Two” wrote:Bob, I’ve looked at the Mast Mate but am disappointed that you need a
track, all I have is a slot. I beieve I’m going with Sea Dog folding
aluminum steps…http://www.go2marine.com/product/209836F/sea-dog-line-folding-mast-step-aluminum.html
…and bummed I can’t find any at the price they used to be. Has any one
used them and did you use threaded SS screws or pop rivets? I don’t think I
will go pop rivets figuring they could weaken after lots of use. The only
issue I see with screws is they need to be exactly the right length and
carefully filed smooth as to not interfere with internal halyards.Ken
Ken and Vicky # 91……Writing a New Chapter Page by Page in an Old Book._______________________________________________
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STAINLESS SCREWS.
Pardon the brevity. I’m typing this on my phone and I hate typing on my
phone.
On May 24, 2014 3:12 PM, “Page Two” wrote:Bob, I’ve looked at the Mast Mate but am disappointed that you need a
track, all I have is a slot. I beieve I’m going with Sea Dog folding
aluminum steps…http://www.go2marine.com/product/209836F/sea-dog-line-folding-mast-step-aluminum.html
…and bummed I can’t find any at the price they used to be. Has any one
used them and did you use threaded SS screws or pop rivets? I don’t think I
will go pop rivets figuring they could weaken after lots of use. The only
issue I see with screws is they need to be exactly the right length and
carefully filed smooth as to not interfere with internal halyards.Ken
Ken and Vicky # 91……Writing a New Chapter Page by Page in an Old Book._______________________________________________
maillist mailing listhttps://pearson424.org/mailman/listinfo/maillist_pearson424.org
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If you put stainless steel screws or bolts into the
aluminum mast, coat each one with LanoCote before
screwing it in. It will last many years longer and will
probably still unscrew 10 years from now. Otherwise,
electrolysis will weld the dissimilar metals together
and eventually destroy one of them. (Bob, you’ll know
which metal it’ll eat, I’m sure.)Tor
Silverheels, P-424 #17
http://www.silverheels.us
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Lanocoat – great for everything, including putting impellers in!
On Sat, May 24, 2014 at 7:59 PM, Silverheels wrote:
Quote:If you put stainless steel screws or bolts into the
aluminum mast, coat each one with LanoCote before
screwing it in. It will last many years longer and will
probably still unscrew 10 years from now. Otherwise,
electrolysis will weld the dissimilar metals together
and eventually destroy one of them. (Bob, you’ll know
which metal it’ll eat, I’m sure.)Tor
Silverheels, P-424 #17
http://www.silverheels.us
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Pete, do you remember what length screws you got? I’d like to not have to cut each one and without an actual step in my hand yet, I can’t make the call on the length.
Where do I find this LanoCote/Lanocoat? …and what is it?
What about Lubriplate #115 or maybe the dreaded silvery anti-seize from Permatex?
Ken
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LanoCote:
https://www.google.com/search?q=LanoCote&ie=utf-8&oe=ut
f-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-
a&channel=sbQuote:
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